Recently I was asked to contribute to a list of 25 Habs prospects under tha age of 25. While the top of the list fell out quite easily because it's top of mind, the middle and the bottom required some thought.
As I got to the middle portions, a lot of players who've been dormant in my mind for some time came back to the forefront. Chief among those was one-time prospect list hotshot Max Pacioretty. Big first round draft pick with rookie scoring at Michigan who makes the Habs at age 19 in a prospect averse era.
How did he ever slip down the counsciousness? What happened? And more pertinent, what is likely to happen from here?
Sound play, no scorer's touch
No matter how much the Canadiens want to will Pacioretty to become a power forward, it seems the signs so far point to a different trajectory.
Pacioretty was selected by the Habs on the back of a 21-goal campaign in the USHL at age 17. 21 goals in the USHL can go many ways (ask his undrafted Sioux City teammates). For Max it appeared to be the start of something good when he tickled the twine 15 times with the powerhouse Wolverines the next season. Still, it was prospect stuff. There were more levels at which he needed to be tested.
We know the story well from there. A goal in his first game, a few in his first week playing with Saku Koivu. He looked a keeper. but then the NHL settled on Max. He took time to work out the checking, how to get free, how to beat a goalie. I say he took time, he's taken time. The time extended through the entirety of his stint last season. No NHL scorer was Max Pacioretty at age 21.
The corroborating evidence for his less than subtle hands comes from the AHL. In 2 seasons and 60 games in total (with playoffs), Max has managed only 9 goals. That's an Andrew Conboy scoring clip.
He's more of a goals prevented than goals created type player. Over 52 games last season he created just 3.7 goals, which translated to 0.33 GC/60. Compared to top-liners who are over 1.00 GC/60, this seemss paltry. Compared to Maxim Lapierre (0.39 GC/60) who was dismal last regular season, flags go up. Goals were even scarce when he was on the ice (20 in all). He was on for about 1.8 GF/60 in all situations, with about 1.33 GF/60 at even strength. This was one of the poorest efforts on the team.
Goal prevention was different story. 1.816 GA/60 overall and 1.80 GA/60 at even strength. Max was the second best full-time player after Glen Metropolit at being stingy at even strength last season. A superb sign for a rookie.
This is not to say I don't think Pacioretty is a good player. It's just that his stats (3G, 1FA, 10SA. 14 Pts) only back up what we see. Unlike other young shooters, he more often than not shies from the shot and the selfish play and instead opts to get a head start on his backchecking assignment. It makes him a fine penalty killer and a great prospect for defensive duty from the front. The problem being that's not perhaps what the Habs expected or even wanted right away from the lanky American.
Down the depth chart
Early last fall, Max Pacioretty was poised to step in for Guillaume Latendresse after any slip. He was pencilled as high as 6th in some Habs depth charts.
His own play, the play of others, and multiple changes and additions make me think he has slipped a substantial amount.
First and foremost is the addition of Pouliot, who outstrips Pacioretty on offense by such a degree that any conversation of Max on the Gomez line starts to seem desperate. Lars Eller has been a cut above Max in the AHL, and Pacioretty's 6 NHL goals can't refute that either.
Next is the rise of Tom Pyatt. He has the coaches blessing and plays a less peripheral game. The addition of Aaron Palushaj also hurts as it seems that Aaron might actually be the USHL Michigan scorer that the Habs intended Max to be. Then there's the additions of guys like Dustin Boyd and Ian Schultz, who aren't better options yet, but aren't far.
If Max is indeed progressing on the path to being a solid defensive forward, he may slip more. This is perhaps unfair, but let's face it, it's easier to teach defense than find offense and grooming a first round pick for 3rd line wing duty for the next 10 years is more suited to the 1970s Canadiens than a team desperately in search of secondary scoring.
Conversion?
This is an idea I floated a long time ago on Pacioretty. Needless to say it was laughed down, but I persist. Given Pacioretty's continued demonstration of strong game awareness and his persistent refusal to look like scoring more than once a month, what about defence?
Pacioretty might be the first convert in a while to go this way on the Habs, but turning a forward to backliner is nothing new at all. Markov was once a forward, and so were countless other NHL Dmen current and past. It might take some doing, but it might also salvage an NHLer from him.
My personal opinion is that it could work, but it would be a wait and see proposition. Pacioretty is big enough and a good enough skater, but there's no telling at how he might find positioning at the back. What's more, it's possible his skills are more suited to being the third man in the shut down move than the first or second.
Still, Ithe way things are going, the Habs will be losing Dmen, have lost Fischer and McDonagh, Valentenko and in all likelihood Emelin. O'Byrne is adequate but not first pairing stuff, Weber, who knows? Beyond Subban, Gorges and Markov there's space for a young buck.
And the forward situation suits this move too. The Habs are loaded with middle talent on the wings through Hamilton and beyond. Pacioretty is a good player, but is likely replacebale via internal promotion.
Showing posts with label Latendresse. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Latendresse. Show all posts
Tuesday, August 24, 2010
Tuesday, January 12, 2010
Attitude Is Everything:
Latendresse And Pouliot After Big Night For Gui
You know those cliches you don't like to hear? Like "attitude is everything".
That really is the last thing you want to hear when you're trying to get something done and it's just not happening. Kind of like when you're battling for your NHL job as a scorer and you just can't score a goal, get an assist or even put two games together that would merit your inclusion on a top line.
"Change your attitude, attitude is everything" is exactly what Guillaume Latendresse needed to hear in Montreal. It's exactly what he didn't want to believe.
6 weeks on from a trade that sent the Guillaume with a terrible attitude out of town for Benoit Pouliot, we are seeing proof positive at what an attitude adjustment can do for a player.
3 games ago, Guillaume had a good game with 7 shots on net for the Wild in their win against Calgary. The next game, he took less shots, but was rewarded for effort with 2 goals in a big win against Chicago. Last night, Guillaume posted a 4 point night with a goal and 3 assists vs. the Penguins – he figured in every goal and potted the game-winner. Not only is Guillaume making up for lost time in the stats races, he's also helping his team win in the process – two things which he had lost touch with in Montreal in his closing shifts.
The renaissance of the player reflects his new positive take on life, and his teammates positive take on him. Everything about the change is evident in this quote below:
The remarkable trade
Tempting as it would be to castigate Bob Gainey over the shipping of the new 12-goal man, you have to think his mere removal from the lineup in the condition he was in was a boon for the team. Add to that the fact that Gainey too picked up a reclamation project that looks to be going right.
Benoit Pouliot, like Guillaume was on the outs on his former team. The day he was traded to Montreal, he hadn't played much either in minutes or games for the Wild. Yes, there was an injury, but there were also benchings.
Although Ben's new start hasn't been the stuff of NHL front page like Gui last night, he's certainly done alright. In 9 games, he's netted 4 goals with no assists in 5 wins, 3 losses and an OTL. Moreover, he's actually been a complement to someone other than Maxim Lapierre, which is something Guillaume tried and failed to accomplish many times over in Hockey Mecca. I can also tell you that Pouliot has already eclipsed Latendresse's marks in both star selections and domes, despite only appearing in one third the games Gui played in. In his interviews, Ben has been positive too, probably belying his new found positive outlook away from the Minnesotan winter.
Statistically speaking...
Montreal Canadiens play
Minnesota Wild play
As you can see, back in the bad old days, Guillaume was a bad player on a better team, while Benoit wasn't winning many friends as someone who could have been helping but instead allowed the 4-9-1 start to happen.
Since the trade, things have turned around for both. Guillaume's taking more shots, with many more going in – 0.48 goals/game – and a much improved shooting percentage. Amazingly, Pouliot has matched Guillaume goal for goal, shot for shot, rate for rate. 0.4+ goals per game is nothing to sneeze at, and is hard to duplicate. Pouliot has done that in his 9 games, netting 2 game-winners in the process. What's more, Pouliot has been shooting 2.5 times a game, like Gui, to fuel his goal totals.
The future
While we don't have eyes into the future, we do have some knowledge of the past. People know, for example, that 20% shooting is not sustainable over time, people know that streaks come and go and 30 games is not enough to project with (much less 9 games). Both these players will slow, both will settle into something a bit less than their current streak suggests. Where that will be is an answer for another time.
For the moment it is unclear to me who will win the Latendresse-Pouliot trade in absolute terms, one thing that is clear is that both teams to this point are winners. Both teams have replaced a tired and negative cog in their machine with a well-oiled component that contributes in a big way to productivity and winning.
That really is the last thing you want to hear when you're trying to get something done and it's just not happening. Kind of like when you're battling for your NHL job as a scorer and you just can't score a goal, get an assist or even put two games together that would merit your inclusion on a top line.
"Change your attitude, attitude is everything" is exactly what Guillaume Latendresse needed to hear in Montreal. It's exactly what he didn't want to believe.
6 weeks on from a trade that sent the Guillaume with a terrible attitude out of town for Benoit Pouliot, we are seeing proof positive at what an attitude adjustment can do for a player.
3 games ago, Guillaume had a good game with 7 shots on net for the Wild in their win against Calgary. The next game, he took less shots, but was rewarded for effort with 2 goals in a big win against Chicago. Last night, Guillaume posted a 4 point night with a goal and 3 assists vs. the Penguins – he figured in every goal and potted the game-winner. Not only is Guillaume making up for lost time in the stats races, he's also helping his team win in the process – two things which he had lost touch with in Montreal in his closing shifts.
The renaissance of the player reflects his new positive take on life, and his teammates positive take on him. Everything about the change is evident in this quote below:
"It's great for me to have the chance to play on a team like that," Latendresse said. "The chemistry's great. I like everything here."He likes everything. Everything! That surely stands in contrast to his exit interview on RDS during which he slagged off managers, coaches, media and just about anyone else. The day he left, you'd be right in saying he liked nothing about being in Montreal.
The remarkable trade
Tempting as it would be to castigate Bob Gainey over the shipping of the new 12-goal man, you have to think his mere removal from the lineup in the condition he was in was a boon for the team. Add to that the fact that Gainey too picked up a reclamation project that looks to be going right.
Benoit Pouliot, like Guillaume was on the outs on his former team. The day he was traded to Montreal, he hadn't played much either in minutes or games for the Wild. Yes, there was an injury, but there were also benchings.
Although Ben's new start hasn't been the stuff of NHL front page like Gui last night, he's certainly done alright. In 9 games, he's netted 4 goals with no assists in 5 wins, 3 losses and an OTL. Moreover, he's actually been a complement to someone other than Maxim Lapierre, which is something Guillaume tried and failed to accomplish many times over in Hockey Mecca. I can also tell you that Pouliot has already eclipsed Latendresse's marks in both star selections and domes, despite only appearing in one third the games Gui played in. In his interviews, Ben has been positive too, probably belying his new found positive outlook away from the Minnesotan winter.
Statistically speaking...
Montreal Canadiens play
| Player | Record | GP | G | A | Pts | +/- | G/G | GWG | Sh | S% |
| Latendresse | 11-11-1 | 23 | 2 | 1 | 3 | -4 | 0.087 | 0 | 27 | 7.41 |
| Pouliot | 5-3-1 | 9 | 4 | 0 | 4 | 0 | 0.444 | 2 | 22 | 18.18 |
Minnesota Wild play
| Player | Record | GP | G | A | Pts | +/- | G/G | GWG | Sh | S% |
| Pouliot | 4-9-1 | 14 | 2 | 2 | 4 | 0 | 0.143 | 0 | 19 | 10.53 |
| Latendresse | 15-6-0 | 21 | 10 | 5 | 15 | 4 | 0.476 | 2 | 51 | 19.61 |
As you can see, back in the bad old days, Guillaume was a bad player on a better team, while Benoit wasn't winning many friends as someone who could have been helping but instead allowed the 4-9-1 start to happen.
Since the trade, things have turned around for both. Guillaume's taking more shots, with many more going in – 0.48 goals/game – and a much improved shooting percentage. Amazingly, Pouliot has matched Guillaume goal for goal, shot for shot, rate for rate. 0.4+ goals per game is nothing to sneeze at, and is hard to duplicate. Pouliot has done that in his 9 games, netting 2 game-winners in the process. What's more, Pouliot has been shooting 2.5 times a game, like Gui, to fuel his goal totals.
The future
While we don't have eyes into the future, we do have some knowledge of the past. People know, for example, that 20% shooting is not sustainable over time, people know that streaks come and go and 30 games is not enough to project with (much less 9 games). Both these players will slow, both will settle into something a bit less than their current streak suggests. Where that will be is an answer for another time.
For the moment it is unclear to me who will win the Latendresse-Pouliot trade in absolute terms, one thing that is clear is that both teams to this point are winners. Both teams have replaced a tired and negative cog in their machine with a well-oiled component that contributes in a big way to productivity and winning.
Tuesday, November 24, 2009
Game #24
Massive Third Period Sinks The Jackets
Details
Date: 23/11/09
Opponent: Blue Jackets
Location: Montreal

Win: 5-3
Habs Goalie: Price (W)
Opposition Goalie: Garon (W)
Habs goalscorers: Cammalleri, Bergeron (2), Metropolit, Lapierre
Opposition goalscorers: Vermette (2), Stralman
It has to be Fedor Tyutin's hooking penalty in the dying seconds of the second period. Did it prevent a goal? No, but boy did it ever launch the Habs. An extension of that play would of course be the intermission. The boys went into the locker room down a goal and with quite a mountain to climb against a team that was outplaying them in most categories. We started the third on the PP and although we didn't score while Tyutin was in the box, we did score almost immediately after he came out. We went on to own that period as we added two more goals and conceded none. Thanks for taking a stupid penalty Columbus, it was nice that it wasn't us for a change.
Maxim Lapierre
Do you think Max has seen the writing on the wall? I mean what do you think of when you hear the name Lapierre? You will probably think of Latendresse. Well, the dynamic duo (not so much this year) has now been separated and my guess is that Max wants to stay. Maybe until now the two took their jobs in their home province for granted, but now I think Laps realizes that he could be next. So, what does he do to prove he wants to stay? Simple, he plays the best game of his season, he gives us the type of performance that we expect from him. 1 goal and +2 may not seem like a lot, but the way he played tonight, compared with how he has been playing, represents a major improvement from the kid.
Max Pacioretty
This Max didn't want to feel left out so he too had the best game of his season. The third period, in particular, was a strong one and I really hope this is something that he can build upon. He didn't manage to score, but he did get a couple of good chances and picked up two helpers in the process.
Tomas Plekanec
I ran out of players who gave their max, but Tomas did play another solid game. He collected 2 assists (both 2nd assists), but played a solid game beyond that. He was the best player on his line, who themselves did do a pretty good job tonight. He seems very capable of carrying the offensive load while we have multiple injuries and I fully expect that to continue when we are fully healthy again.
Defencemen
Roman Hamrlik
Defensively this was a very strong game from Hammer. He stood out amongst a group that got better as the game went on (Gorges in particular was also quite strong). There was one occasion in which Roman stripped Nash of the puck, near the goal in the third which I believe prevented what could have been a decent chance against us. Now, stats show that he was on the ice for all of our goals against, but I can only stress that winning this game may not have even been possible had he not been there to reduce the damage.
Marc-Andre Bergeron - Game Puck
The good news is that MAB, despite one brutal icing, played a pretty neutral game in his own end. He still got scared when fore-chekers were coming at him, but he took steps to ensure nothing too catastrophic happened. Offensively, however, he had an amazing game. In all he took over 1/4 of our total shots (8), played for 21 minutes, was +3 and, oh ya, he scored 2 goals including the game-winner.
Goaltender
Carey Price
Carey's play continues. Tonight he wasn't dominant, but he did do very well early on to keep the goals to 3 or less. Columbus out-worked and out-chanced us in the opening 40 minutes and Price ensured that the game was always going to be ours if we wanted it. I find that one big improvement for him has been the way in which he is taking the initial shot. He is smothering pucks better, directing them into corners with a higher frequency and seems to be better positioned in the first place to receive these shots.
Comments
When you think of what our team was supposed to be back at the end of September it may surprise you to read tonight's line-up card. How about these names - Wyman, White, Pyatt, Chipchura, S. Kostitsyn, Pacioretty, Leach, Begeron, O'Byrne. That is 9 players, of 19, that we didn't expect to be in our 'ideal' line-up. Well, with injuries and departures this is our reality. And, you know what, we are making it work. Tonight was a good example of how hard work does pay off. Over the course of the first two periods we were out-played by a more talented team. Our best elements (Cammalleri, Plekanec and Price) kept us in the game, however. Then the third period was all about hard work and persistence. We kept coming and Columbus just couldn't hold on. Once the third started you could feel a goal was coming. The funny thing, however, is that after we scored that feeling didn't go away, it remained for the rest of the game.
There is a big test tomorrow and I think a point (even a hard-fought 1-goal loss) would prove that this team can indeed play with the big boys after all. I do think that with good goaltending and a solid work ethic (even Sergei had that tonight) we can certainly continue on this current upward trend.
Labels:
Bergeron,
Blue Jackets,
Cammalleri,
Canadiens,
Columbus,
Gainey,
Gionta,
Gomez,
Habs,
Hamrlik,
Kostitsyn,
Lapierre,
Latendresse,
Markov,
Metropolit,
Montreal,
Pacioretty,
Plekanec,
Price,
Win
Latendresse Vs. Pouliot
Season Preview All Over Again
In the style of the beloved season previews, I offer to you Benoit Pouliot's belated preview next to the now very optimistic-looking one we did for Latendresse in September. While it certainly shows we lost a good player who many of us thought had some promise, it also reveals some surprises about the new Canadiens forward.
Guillaume Latendresse
Legend
Stats notes
You could go many ways in interpreting these stats. Many numbers show clear decline, despite the progress that Gui is touted for. On the other hand, there is some stability within them too. The things to note:
1) Gui shoots straight
It's perhaps not that surprising that the skill that got him to the NHL is the one that stands out. 12.0% in an off year is not a stat I'd ever sneeze at.
2) Good production at even strength, considering
About a goal every 60 minutes of ice time is a good average to carry in you NHL career. Considering Gui's been bumped around lines a lot, not been given primo PP time and played with chance sink Kostopoulos a lot last year, then I find that encouraging. Hopefully he keeps up the pace.
3) Wonky even strength profile
As much as I'd like to think that Gui is one of the best defensive forwards on the team, the fact that I do have eyes helps me over the feeling. His profile shows us the danger of taking things out of context. Last season, Gui played at all the right times and missed the worst Price/Halak had to offer. Has it skewed the profile? Is Guillaume really 2nd best in Corsi? Perhaps the Canadiens lost all those games because he was injured? Impossible to tell for certain in a one-off experiment, but again, we do all have eyes, and sense.
As we've mentioned, 2009-10 is a big season for Latendresse. Because let's face it, another 14-16 goal campaign, while fine, certainly doesn't add to the lustre of the future 30-goal man argument. And, if it is to be 15 goals a year from here on in, then someone, somewhere is bound to surpass him, at least in terms of potential.
His shooting accuracy teamed with a new approach to shooting more should help. His defensive game and any improvement in the purpose of his hitting will make this line a very threatening one.
Tobalev on Latendresse
For some reason I am excited about Latendresse this year. Maybe it is because I see him as the best of the players from my home province, maybe it's because he is one of the longest serving Habs, or maybe it is because I actually sense a big season coming on. Whatever happens with goals and assists, Latendresse is still a player that wants to play for the Habs and generally tries pretty hard, despite some talent shortcomings.
Unfortunately for Gui, however, nothing is guaranteed. There are signs, after all that point to him not having that great of a season. His production levels have been stable for 3 years, he seems to be getting slower and he may very well get crowded out of the top-6/PP.
On the positive side, I think his new status on the team (best Quebecer) will help him, especially early in the season. Many fans and new teammates will look to him now as a leader and not just a prospect. If he can get in Martin’s good books and get himself onto a scoring line early on then I could see him there all year. If he makes the most of these chances when provided, the outlook could brighten in a hurry – I really think he could score 25 goals.
The more likely scenario, however, is that he gets bounced between the top 3 lines and into/out of the PP (thanks to injuries, slumps etc.). This will hurt his production and that is why I think he’ll likely top out at 30-35 points with most of those coming as goals.
Where Latendresse will start 2009-10: Carrying the torch for millions
Where Latendresse will end 2009-10: With a new appreciation for what he can do in this league
Points: 21 G, 24 A, 45 Pts
Benoit Pouliot
Legend
Stats notes
The first impression when looking at these stats side by side is something like: "My goodness, we were fleeced..." But as we know statistics do need interpreting. And, as we all recall, Guillaume's stats from last year flattered him. As this was a trade, we'll do this a bit differently, pointing out a few differences I think it is absolutely vital to note. Note also, that being a Habs fan who wants to view this trade in a positive light, I'll leave the negative comparisons to you readers to make:
1) Shot totals
Prior to this season, Benoit Pouliot managed a measly 45 shots in 51 games. Guillaume had that many shots in his NHL career well before his 20th birthday. It's worth noting because whether it be linemates, coaching or something else, Pouliot has just never had the chance to let loose his shot (of similar accuracy based on %) compared to Gui. Is he a Sergei Kostitsyn who holds and hold and holds? Perhaps, but the scouts in 2005 didn't think so.
2) Defensive numbers
Guillaume from his profile showed a good defensive player (though we mentioned this was puzzling to those who had observed him). Pouliot really does one up him. Now before you go and say that Benoit has benefited from being on the Wild, do first consider that his 1.53 GA/60 was third on the team after Boogaard and Kolanos. Other young forwards like Clutterbuck (2.11) and James Sheppard (2.84) lagged behind his defensive responsibility greatly. What's more only Pouliot came out positive on +/- from the youngsters. Not all bad from the guy with 14 previous games under his belt.
3) Games played
I alluded to experience in shots. Well, Pouliot (from the same draft year as Latendresse) has played 167 less games in all. This is also critical for waivers. Benoit Pouliot signed his first NHL contract in May 2006 at age 19. As such, it set the clock on his waiver exemption to 4 seasons or 160 games (whichever came first). Given that he's nowhere near reaching 160 games anytime soon, it means the time limit on him seeing waivers will be the outset of next season. Of course, for the Canadiens, this provides another player they can ship up and down to Hamilton (like Sergei Kostitsyn, Pyatt, White, etc.). Guillaume Latendresse would have had to clear waivers to go to Hamilton, which had been the case since his 160th game early last season. No matter how few goals he scored, how badly he sulked or how much he needed a wake up call – Gainey's hands were tied on Guillaume. Don't underestimate this factor in the trade that just occurred.
A simple glance at the stats says loss for Gainey in this file. But under a bit more scrutiny, Gainey has manufactured a bit more flex with his roster by simply trading one 2-goalscorer with potential to do more for another. When injuries heal, I truly think this flexibility will tip the balance in the Habs favour, espeically if Sulkatron-2000 was going to react to benching anything like he reacted to be being traded.
Statistics adapted from nhl.com, behindthenet.ca, Olivier
Guillaume Latendresse
| NHL Season | GP | G | A | Pts | +/- | PPG | GWG | G/60 | Pts/60 | Sh | S% | PIM |
| 08-09 (MTL) | 56 | 14 | 12 | 26 | +4 | 1 | 2 | 1.10 | 2.05 | 117 | 12.0 | 45 |
| 07-08 (MTL) | 73 | 16 | 11 | 27 | -2 | 2 | 3 | 1.07 | 1.81 | 116 | 13.8 | 41 |
| 06-07 (MTL) | 80 | 16 | 13 | 29 | -20 | 5 | 3 | 0.95 | 1.73 | 121 | 13.2 | 47 |
Stats notes
You could go many ways in interpreting these stats. Many numbers show clear decline, despite the progress that Gui is touted for. On the other hand, there is some stability within them too. The things to note:
1) Gui shoots straight
It's perhaps not that surprising that the skill that got him to the NHL is the one that stands out. 12.0% in an off year is not a stat I'd ever sneeze at.
2) Good production at even strength, considering
About a goal every 60 minutes of ice time is a good average to carry in you NHL career. Considering Gui's been bumped around lines a lot, not been given primo PP time and played with chance sink Kostopoulos a lot last year, then I find that encouraging. Hopefully he keeps up the pace.
3) Wonky even strength profile
As much as I'd like to think that Gui is one of the best defensive forwards on the team, the fact that I do have eyes helps me over the feeling. His profile shows us the danger of taking things out of context. Last season, Gui played at all the right times and missed the worst Price/Halak had to offer. Has it skewed the profile? Is Guillaume really 2nd best in Corsi? Perhaps the Canadiens lost all those games because he was injured? Impossible to tell for certain in a one-off experiment, but again, we do all have eyes, and sense.
As we've mentioned, 2009-10 is a big season for Latendresse. Because let's face it, another 14-16 goal campaign, while fine, certainly doesn't add to the lustre of the future 30-goal man argument. And, if it is to be 15 goals a year from here on in, then someone, somewhere is bound to surpass him, at least in terms of potential.
His shooting accuracy teamed with a new approach to shooting more should help. His defensive game and any improvement in the purpose of his hitting will make this line a very threatening one.
Tobalev on Latendresse
For some reason I am excited about Latendresse this year. Maybe it is because I see him as the best of the players from my home province, maybe it's because he is one of the longest serving Habs, or maybe it is because I actually sense a big season coming on. Whatever happens with goals and assists, Latendresse is still a player that wants to play for the Habs and generally tries pretty hard, despite some talent shortcomings.
Unfortunately for Gui, however, nothing is guaranteed. There are signs, after all that point to him not having that great of a season. His production levels have been stable for 3 years, he seems to be getting slower and he may very well get crowded out of the top-6/PP.
On the positive side, I think his new status on the team (best Quebecer) will help him, especially early in the season. Many fans and new teammates will look to him now as a leader and not just a prospect. If he can get in Martin’s good books and get himself onto a scoring line early on then I could see him there all year. If he makes the most of these chances when provided, the outlook could brighten in a hurry – I really think he could score 25 goals.
The more likely scenario, however, is that he gets bounced between the top 3 lines and into/out of the PP (thanks to injuries, slumps etc.). This will hurt his production and that is why I think he’ll likely top out at 30-35 points with most of those coming as goals.
Where Latendresse will start 2009-10: Carrying the torch for millions
Where Latendresse will end 2009-10: With a new appreciation for what he can do in this league
Points: 21 G, 24 A, 45 Pts
Benoit Pouliot
| NHL Season | GP | G | A | Pts | +/- | PPG | GWG | G/60 | Pts/60 | Sh | S% | PIM |
| 08-09 (MIN) | 37 | 5 | 6 | 11 | +1 | 2 | 1 | 0.68 | 1.51 | 34 | 14.7 | 18 |
| 07-08 (MIN) | 11 | 2 | 1 | 3 | -1 | 0 | 0 | 1.24 | 1.86 | 10 | 20.0 | 0 |
| 06-07 (MIN) | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | -1 | 0 | 0 | 0.00 | 0.00 | 1 | 0.0 | 0 |
| Even-strength profile | |
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Stats notes
The first impression when looking at these stats side by side is something like: "My goodness, we were fleeced..." But as we know statistics do need interpreting. And, as we all recall, Guillaume's stats from last year flattered him. As this was a trade, we'll do this a bit differently, pointing out a few differences I think it is absolutely vital to note. Note also, that being a Habs fan who wants to view this trade in a positive light, I'll leave the negative comparisons to you readers to make:
1) Shot totals
Prior to this season, Benoit Pouliot managed a measly 45 shots in 51 games. Guillaume had that many shots in his NHL career well before his 20th birthday. It's worth noting because whether it be linemates, coaching or something else, Pouliot has just never had the chance to let loose his shot (of similar accuracy based on %) compared to Gui. Is he a Sergei Kostitsyn who holds and hold and holds? Perhaps, but the scouts in 2005 didn't think so.
2) Defensive numbers
Guillaume from his profile showed a good defensive player (though we mentioned this was puzzling to those who had observed him). Pouliot really does one up him. Now before you go and say that Benoit has benefited from being on the Wild, do first consider that his 1.53 GA/60 was third on the team after Boogaard and Kolanos. Other young forwards like Clutterbuck (2.11) and James Sheppard (2.84) lagged behind his defensive responsibility greatly. What's more only Pouliot came out positive on +/- from the youngsters. Not all bad from the guy with 14 previous games under his belt.
3) Games played
I alluded to experience in shots. Well, Pouliot (from the same draft year as Latendresse) has played 167 less games in all. This is also critical for waivers. Benoit Pouliot signed his first NHL contract in May 2006 at age 19. As such, it set the clock on his waiver exemption to 4 seasons or 160 games (whichever came first). Given that he's nowhere near reaching 160 games anytime soon, it means the time limit on him seeing waivers will be the outset of next season. Of course, for the Canadiens, this provides another player they can ship up and down to Hamilton (like Sergei Kostitsyn, Pyatt, White, etc.). Guillaume Latendresse would have had to clear waivers to go to Hamilton, which had been the case since his 160th game early last season. No matter how few goals he scored, how badly he sulked or how much he needed a wake up call – Gainey's hands were tied on Guillaume. Don't underestimate this factor in the trade that just occurred.
A simple glance at the stats says loss for Gainey in this file. But under a bit more scrutiny, Gainey has manufactured a bit more flex with his roster by simply trading one 2-goalscorer with potential to do more for another. When injuries heal, I truly think this flexibility will tip the balance in the Habs favour, espeically if Sulkatron-2000 was going to react to benching anything like he reacted to be being traded.
Statistics adapted from nhl.com, behindthenet.ca, Olivier
Monday, November 23, 2009
Latendresse For Pouliot
Meeting The New Hab
In a move that flies completely in the face of those who advocate deadline only trading, Bob Gainey has moved Guillaume Latendresse for Benoit Pouliot of the Minnesota Wild. Arpon Basu wonders whether it's a trade of untapped (or indeed non-existent) potential here...

While he's right and many may question the professional scouts read on the tentative NHL beginnings of Benoit Pouliot, Guillaume Latendresse's time in Montreal was beginning to try on the young man. Reports mere minutes after his trade talk of his relief to be dealt away from the furnace of Montreal hockey.
It's a hard trade to take for the biggest believers in Latendresse, but it would be hard even for them to deny what has become clear – that despite his talent, he will probably never acquire a taste for hanging out in front of the net, despite mentioning Tomas Holmstrom in every other interview. Seeing as he's opting not to go the route of power forward, it seems Gainey and the management have opted to put the stakes of just under a million on a player with a different complement of talents, and just about as much size. One of those talents does happen to be skating – which may just fit in better with a team that had to slow down for Gui at times.
Benoit Pouliot himself is a Franco-Canadian, and speaks French. So although the omission of Latendresse takes the number of Quebecers to the equal season low of three, it maintains the RDS correspondents at an equilibrium.
He was once judged to be a massive talent and in the Crosby draft was even considered to be the next man in the pecking order. Central scouting had him as the #2 consensus pick, scouts compared him to Lecavalier. Since that time, his progress has been rocky – rockier, it must be said than Latendresse's. However, Pouliot has been groomed the traditional way, and for the most part in a defensive system – two things that may help him to adjust better to life under Jacques Martin than Guillaume.If you want a taste of speculative good news, it is that his former coach (and hockey guru) Jacques Lemaire was supposedly plugging for the kid in Jersey as recently as last Tuesday, so take that for what it's worth. Thanks to Saskhab for pointing out my frantic misread of a headline – to make up for it, some speculation that actually did take place (Habs last year) and whatever he says today on his blog, Mirtle liked Pouliot second best in July 2005 – better than Ryan, Johnson, and Brule.
At the junior level, he was once an unknown who became a rookie of the year in the OHL (and the CHL!), and then a 4th overall pick. His biggest achievement post-draft to date has been a gold at the World Junior champs with 5 assists in 6 games – team that Latendresse also made (but didn't really play for) and Chipchura captained. Following that, another good year in junior with improved totals and then on to the AHL.
While he has certainly not set the world alight in the AHL, he has nonetheless put up 38 goals and 84 points in 143 games. Again, the Houston Aeros have been a mirror of their parent Wild club, stressing defence over all else, so his points may sell him short. The fact he made a prolonged playoff run last year may also have given him some experience of value in his apprenticeship, though now it feels like we're clutching at straws.
At the NHL level, it's also been a trial. When you consider Guillaume's 50-odd goals in the big leagues, it seems like a big step down to Pouliot's nine. And another big leap to call that potential equal to, or superior to, that of Guillaume Latendresse. However, his route to the NHL has been so divergent from Lats'. Never has he enjoyed the extended wing time with Saku Koivu or even Robert Lang that Guillaume did. Nor has he been reserved preferential treatment for development opportunities. That is until this season.
I could go on, but what you will all want to read on the new guy has already been written. Go fill your boots with: "The Ballad of Benoit Pouliot", an article that relays the Minnesota Wild fan's thoughts on our new ward very nicely.
Who wins the trade?
Well, some text from the article on Pouliot could have been lifted straight form the Guillaume Latendresse archives:
However, never would anyone attribute the following to Big Gui:
There's optimism in knowing that a player coming to play a game where skating is half the battle doesn't need summer courses to keep up with the slower half of his peers. There's optimism knowing that a broken player weighed down by unreasonable expectation will be replaced by one with expectations of his own. There's optimism in knowing that only 4 years ago about 30 men trained to evaluate players said the new guy was a better bet than the outgoing. If for no other reason than those, I find positive thoughts in this trade.

While he's right and many may question the professional scouts read on the tentative NHL beginnings of Benoit Pouliot, Guillaume Latendresse's time in Montreal was beginning to try on the young man. Reports mere minutes after his trade talk of his relief to be dealt away from the furnace of Montreal hockey.
It's a hard trade to take for the biggest believers in Latendresse, but it would be hard even for them to deny what has become clear – that despite his talent, he will probably never acquire a taste for hanging out in front of the net, despite mentioning Tomas Holmstrom in every other interview. Seeing as he's opting not to go the route of power forward, it seems Gainey and the management have opted to put the stakes of just under a million on a player with a different complement of talents, and just about as much size. One of those talents does happen to be skating – which may just fit in better with a team that had to slow down for Gui at times.
Benoit Pouliot himself is a Franco-Canadian, and speaks French. So although the omission of Latendresse takes the number of Quebecers to the equal season low of three, it maintains the RDS correspondents at an equilibrium.
He was once judged to be a massive talent and in the Crosby draft was even considered to be the next man in the pecking order. Central scouting had him as the #2 consensus pick, scouts compared him to Lecavalier. Since that time, his progress has been rocky – rockier, it must be said than Latendresse's. However, Pouliot has been groomed the traditional way, and for the most part in a defensive system – two things that may help him to adjust better to life under Jacques Martin than Guillaume.
At the junior level, he was once an unknown who became a rookie of the year in the OHL (and the CHL!), and then a 4th overall pick. His biggest achievement post-draft to date has been a gold at the World Junior champs with 5 assists in 6 games – team that Latendresse also made (but didn't really play for) and Chipchura captained. Following that, another good year in junior with improved totals and then on to the AHL.
While he has certainly not set the world alight in the AHL, he has nonetheless put up 38 goals and 84 points in 143 games. Again, the Houston Aeros have been a mirror of their parent Wild club, stressing defence over all else, so his points may sell him short. The fact he made a prolonged playoff run last year may also have given him some experience of value in his apprenticeship, though now it feels like we're clutching at straws.
At the NHL level, it's also been a trial. When you consider Guillaume's 50-odd goals in the big leagues, it seems like a big step down to Pouliot's nine. And another big leap to call that potential equal to, or superior to, that of Guillaume Latendresse. However, his route to the NHL has been so divergent from Lats'. Never has he enjoyed the extended wing time with Saku Koivu or even Robert Lang that Guillaume did. Nor has he been reserved preferential treatment for development opportunities. That is until this season.
I could go on, but what you will all want to read on the new guy has already been written. Go fill your boots with: "The Ballad of Benoit Pouliot", an article that relays the Minnesota Wild fan's thoughts on our new ward very nicely.
Who wins the trade?
Well, some text from the article on Pouliot could have been lifted straight form the Guillaume Latendresse archives:
"With the regime change in Minnesota, many were expecting Pouliot to fall by the wayside. Certainly there would have been enough reason to. But Chuck Fletcher decided to give the youngster another shot. Pouliot came into camp this season ready to prove himself and, again, he has certainly shown flashes of what he is capable of."
However, never would anyone attribute the following to Big Gui:
"But what stood out most to me, was that he skated hard without actually looking like he skated hard. It dawned on me that maybe this is one of the reasons that he has been given the label of lazy. Because, quite simply, while everyone looks like they’re skating on the ice, he looks like he’s skating above it."
There's optimism in knowing that a player coming to play a game where skating is half the battle doesn't need summer courses to keep up with the slower half of his peers. There's optimism knowing that a broken player weighed down by unreasonable expectation will be replaced by one with expectations of his own. There's optimism in knowing that only 4 years ago about 30 men trained to evaluate players said the new guy was a better bet than the outgoing. If for no other reason than those, I find positive thoughts in this trade.
Tuesday, November 03, 2009
Game #15
Price Drops the Ball...Again
Details
Date: 3/11/09
Opponent: Thrashers
Location: Montreal
Loss: 4-5
Habs Goalie: Price (L)
Opposition Goalie: Pavelec (W)
Habs goalscorers: Gionta (2), Cammalleri, Plekanec
Opposition goalscorers: Little, Peverley, Popovic, Kubina, Armstrong
I really liked the 4th goal, Plekanec's. Can you believe that at the time I actually thought that it would be enough to send us to OT; I obviously underestimated Price's consistency. The play started at our blue-line when Latendresse grabbed the puck and quickly got it to Lapierre on his right. Then, that line, all 3 of them, went off up the ice. Lapierre sent it back to Gui who kept the puck going to Pleks who was out wide on the left. Tomas froze Pavelec and then, from a sharp angle, went upstairs to tie it at 4.
Tomas Plekanec
I had the list down to 4 forwards and I think Pleks was third on the list. So, I just wanted to mention that Gomez, despite not being chosen, played almost as well as Pleks and could have easily been placed in here. Tomas, however, had the edge thanks to his goal and a few other key offensive plays. He also had 3 shots on net, was 60% at face-offs and was quite gritty all game long.
Mike Cammalleri
Another 'pure-goal-scorer' game from Mike. Whether it be the fact that he always seems to be in the right place or that he can rocket the shot from just about anywhere or that he took 4 quite menacing shots or that he scored a very soft 5-hole goal there is just one way to describe this player and that is - amazing. Too bad he can't play D or goal...although come to think of it would it be that bad? I mean some of our players in those positions also have that deficiency.
Brian Gionta - Game Puck
I was very happy with Brian's game tonight and quite liked the way in which he scored his two goals. They were both quick and accurate shots that caught this 'phenom' off guard. He wasn't too great defensively tonight, but made up for that by spending most of his 21 minutes in the other end. In all he took 6 shots and could have easily ended with more than two goals.
Defencemen
Josh Gorges
Spacek and Hammer each gave the puck away 5 times and both took more silly penalties. As good as those two can be they can also be quite careless at times. Neither played horribly, but neither shone. Bergeron and Carle were just bad, they brought nothing apart from poor, uncomfortable and defensively-inept play. That leaves two players. Josh, once again is one of those players that I didn't really notice for good or bad. That is why I am happy that that calming influence was actually on the ice for over 20 minutes.
Paul Mara
Mara stood out a little more than Gorges did and that, for the most part, is thanks to his play in the offensive zone. I thought that he did quite well on the PP and had a few other moments where he supported the attack nicely. He made a good pairing with Josh, but that may become a luxury that Martin will have to reconsider unless he really thinks he can roll with 4 D-men each night.
Goaltender
Jaroslav Halak
Price was bad tonight and likely cost us points. We have to look beyond a few things here to get to the truth about this game. I'll forget that our D, at times, was weak as, let's face it, they are always weak. I will give Carey the benefit of the doubt and forget that Atlanta isn't quite what you would call a 'cream of the league' type team. I'll even forget that he only faced 30 shots. No, for this assessment I will just look at the 5 goals (I'll even forget the other, non-goal, pucks that seemed to get by him with a certain regularity). I will forgive the first goal as it was unlucky. Yes, maybe he is the 'unluckiest' goalie ever, but I'll move on. The third goal, Popovic's, was pathetic. It was a floater from the point which never deflected, but Price still had trouble lining his foot-wide trapper with it. Then, the other three goals, were all pretty much the same and this is clearly something other teams have seen. Carey, on all of them, over-committed to the left side of his net. He stayed deep, hugged the post and crouched down. It is probably a great way to defend against low shots from the corner, but apparently not a good way to defend against much else. In all 3 cases the puck was passed across the crease to his right where an Atlanta player had very little to do but put it on net. This lesson in physics (pucks move faster than Carey) has obviously been lost on our 'positionally-sound', 'franchise player'. Now, the reason I choose Halak tonight isn't because I necessarily think Jaro is that great, but, no matter how bad Price is, we know one thing for certain; Halak, right now (and for most of the past 3 years), is far and away the better goalie.
Comments
You outplay a team, you out-chance a team and you even out-shoot them by over 25%, but you can't get a point. Why is that? Well, for the most part we have too few skilled players to get the job done. That said, I think that the forwards are getting the job done offensively. In fact I'll add our D to that list as I feel they are helping enough on attack. Our big problems, as you all know, are in our own end. Tonight we dressed 4 NHL players from the blue-line back. Carle, Bergeron and Price all played quite terribly and, in one way or another, cost us. All the effort in the world, unfortunately, can't make up for that deficiency. Not so fast forwards and other D. While you aren't horrible in your own end, you aren't that great either. This aspect of our play really has to improve if we want to go far. Yes, Markov is injured, but why is that an excuse? What kind of management is that? If you are a production manager and your best employee leaves do you just let productivity decline? No, of course not, you do something about it. Right now, however, Martin can do little to help the sinking ship that is our D (apart from not playing Price) because he has been supplied with elbow patches, from Gainey, to fill head-sized holes.
This is a rough start to the week and one that may cost us a good start to November. I know what the thought was tonight; 'Price has learned his lesson, he is ready, he's our number one and he'll have no trouble against Atlanta. This win will build his confidence and we'll build on that'. Well, cliches didn't work, but what may have is the simplest rule in sports - use your best pieces whenever you can. There is no rule that states Carey has to play games is there? Does he need a certain amount of starts? Nope. They dropped the ball tonight by hoping a worse option in goal would be good enough. After seeing Price play this year there is only one certainty when it comes to him - no games will ever be easy for this kid.
The Insufferable Gagnon
Character Assassin At It Again
I've told you all about Francois Gagnon before, but let me assure you I wouldn't be writing this article today if I wasn't irate.
Yesterday, Gagnon on a slow news day once again took up his favourite topic: Andrei Kostitsyn. It's another in a long line of attacks on the player, as Gagnon slowly deteriorates into the tabloid caricature that he is now.
His piece begins:
While he asks whether Guillaume is suffering from a double standard while his sanctions are not lifted as promptly as AK46's, despite (what Gagnon says is) a virtual carbon copy career.
First off, I'll be clear here. I think both players should be within the top 6 players. I have been saying that since the summer, I have been consistent in my call for best hands on deck on offence. I can't say I approve of Jacques Martin's approach to teaching (punishing) young forwards, but I accept that he is probably trying to do it for rewards down the line.
I didn't want to get into an Andrei vs. Guillaume post, because who's 5 and 6 in the top 6 isn't really that relevant to me at the moment when our offence needs a 5 or a 6 to emerge at all. I approach this as a statement of the facts that have been misused, misquoted and used to mislead. Guillaume Latendresse and Andrei Kostitsyn have not, for a start, had carbon copy careers.
Opportunities
Throughout Gagnon's piece, the continual implication is that Latendresse hasn't been given a fair shake with the Habs. While, there may certainly be a case with Jacques Martin's one month of handling personnel decisions, to extend the conclusion to a career is ludicrous.
A little education on Latendresse for those (like Gagnon, and Latendresse himself!) who really can't remember past this September:
Latendresse's rookie year, he played 36 games on one of the top two lines. His longest stint was not limited to 3 or 4 games as Guillaume cries about now, but rather 18 consecutive games with Saku Koivu from game 14 to game 31 of 2006-07.
And he hasn't been deprived of chances latterly either. In 2007-08, Kostitsyn started with a 5 game audition on Grabovski's wing with Kovalev, but from games 6 to 13 in 2007-08, it was Guillaume who got first dibs on trying the Plekanec, Kovalev combination.
His single goal was to be typical of all his future auditions. Take last season for example. Far from a couple of games, Guillaume actually started the first ten games on the top line for the Habs with Koivu and Tanguay. The line was agreat success, but Carbonneau must have deemed that Koivu and Tanguay were the main catalyst (they were) as Guilaume for his 7 points, only managed one goal again.
In all, he's played 76 games on one of the top two lines, and that's to say nothing of the times he's played on Robert Lang, Bryan Smolinski and Maxim Lapierre's line and received top ice time. To say Latendresse hasn't had a fair shake, therefore, is more than a bit disingenuous, and Gagnon must know it. He's had many, at least 4 or 5 very extended long looks and each time the coaches in charge have decided against granting him the permanent freedom of that designation.
Kostitsyn isn't really so different. He too has been given chances. The main difference being that in 2007-08 he made it count to the tune of 20 goals in his last 46 games.
But know this, as well. Andrei Kostitsyn got his chance after serving an apprenticeship in the AHL of almost 3 seasons. He played 180 games in all down in Hamilton where he scored 51 goals and 71 assists. His final season was 2006-07 where (with Guillaume 2 years his junior already in the NHL) he scored 20 goals and 32 assists in 50 contests.
When he came up to the NHL and finally earned a top line position around Game 63 of the 2006-07 season, he seized his opportunity by earning 11 points in those last 18 games. What's more, for his decent points total, his line was a constant threat and Plekanec was set alight with Andrei at the side.
Even then, nothing was earned for the young Belarussian. Leading the Hamilton Bulldogs in scoring, playing inspired hockey with the entrenched number 2 centre and already acknowledged for his talent was not enough to get a pass. Nor should it have been. As mentioned, once Grabovski sunk, it was Latendresse who auditioned for the wing to complement Pleks and Kovalev. Only after 8 games of Guillaume's tantalizing size, teamed with frustratingly few goals did Carbo shift Andrei in. Though Andrei did well, he like Gui didn't explode for points. But perhaps he was saved by the fact that Plekanec and Kovalev looked better with him at their side. Carbo's rare patience wasn't tested too much either, since Kostitsyn within a month of being given the opportunity was driving the line into December.
Stats play
One of the things that most frustrated me about Gagnon's thin excuse for journalism was this:
It's a classic hatchet job on the stats. Opportunity to incorporate 34 games for Andrei where he largely did nothing during his adjustment (3 G in 34 games). Opportunity to ignore assists and what we can all see with our eyes altogether. Opportunity to put similar totals side by said and say they are the same.
It's a mess. Start with the goals. 53 in 200 is not 48 in 223. Andrei's scoring 0.265 goals a game, while Gui's clocking up 0.215. it may not seem like much, except over 82 games it's 4 goals – the difference between a proven 20 goalscorer for instance, and an aspiring one.
Next the assists. I think we know hockey is more than goals by individuals. Even with all the flaws of assists as a stat, I think we can appreciate that someone with an assist has contributed somewhat to a goal. I think we can appreciate how someone with 59 career assists has done a lot more than someone with 38. Pro-rate those and you get 0.295 vs. 0.156.
But let's all be sensible here. We have been watching as well. Until 2 years ago, Andrei Kostitsyn was a name to us, but not a player. In the two seasons since, he has actually been a 26 and a 23 goalscorer and had flashes of brilliance. Guillaume on the other hand has been about as good as the day of his promotion for the past 3 years. His rookie season he was a 16 goal man, the next season the same. Last season 14 goals. Seeing him as a one-day 20 goalscorer is debate enough, putting him the proven category is daydreaming.
Gagnon called out
The one thing I take heart from is the fact that Gagnon's blog generated a lot of commentary yesterday. And, while there were plenty of sycophants hoping for a pat on the back in return, a vast number (perhaps even the majority) of readers told him largely what I just told you.
Paul Bernier said this:
Jejol8 said this:
Teamstef said this:
It continues...
Francois Gagnon, in his unexplained character assassination attempt on the Kostitsyns is apparently only digging his own grave. I can only assume he's consumed with it and doesn't even realise. If I ever descend into this state, I implore you all – tell me.
The Habs top lines then
All this to say, it's all nonsense. If the Canadiens want to score more goals they must stop trying to choose between Kostitsyn and Latendresse and choose the two of them. Yes Kostitsyn is ultimately the more talented, but Guilaume has his merits and at his best offers the 6th best skill set on the team.
I suppose the day that Glen Metropolit and Travis Moen stop scoring from behind the goal line is the day the coach can put his best PP out and start forming lines that will last.
Yesterday, Gagnon on a slow news day once again took up his favourite topic: Andrei Kostitsyn. It's another in a long line of attacks on the player, as Gagnon slowly deteriorates into the tabloid caricature that he is now.
His piece begins:
La semaine dernière à Pittsburgh, j’ai mis table pour le match Canadien-Penguins en me posant des questions sur les chances répétées accordées à Andrei Kostitsyn et au fait que les sanctions qu’on lui imposait étaient vite levées.
Je me demandais pourquoi Guillaume Latendresse était «victime» d’une situation inverse.
L’une des raisons est certainement le manque de constance et l’impression de demi-mesure que démontre parfois Guillaume Latendresse. Trop souvent à mon goût si je peux me permettre d’en rajouter un peu.
Cela dit, le plus vieux des frères K n’est pas un exemple d’éthique de travail et de don inconditionnel de soi pour la cause et l’équipe...
While he asks whether Guillaume is suffering from a double standard while his sanctions are not lifted as promptly as AK46's, despite (what Gagnon says is) a virtual carbon copy career.
First off, I'll be clear here. I think both players should be within the top 6 players. I have been saying that since the summer, I have been consistent in my call for best hands on deck on offence. I can't say I approve of Jacques Martin's approach to teaching (punishing) young forwards, but I accept that he is probably trying to do it for rewards down the line.
I didn't want to get into an Andrei vs. Guillaume post, because who's 5 and 6 in the top 6 isn't really that relevant to me at the moment when our offence needs a 5 or a 6 to emerge at all. I approach this as a statement of the facts that have been misused, misquoted and used to mislead. Guillaume Latendresse and Andrei Kostitsyn have not, for a start, had carbon copy careers.
Opportunities
Throughout Gagnon's piece, the continual implication is that Latendresse hasn't been given a fair shake with the Habs. While, there may certainly be a case with Jacques Martin's one month of handling personnel decisions, to extend the conclusion to a career is ludicrous.
A little education on Latendresse for those (like Gagnon, and Latendresse himself!) who really can't remember past this September:
Latendresse's rookie year, he played 36 games on one of the top two lines. His longest stint was not limited to 3 or 4 games as Guillaume cries about now, but rather 18 consecutive games with Saku Koivu from game 14 to game 31 of 2006-07.
And he hasn't been deprived of chances latterly either. In 2007-08, Kostitsyn started with a 5 game audition on Grabovski's wing with Kovalev, but from games 6 to 13 in 2007-08, it was Guillaume who got first dibs on trying the Plekanec, Kovalev combination.
His single goal was to be typical of all his future auditions. Take last season for example. Far from a couple of games, Guillaume actually started the first ten games on the top line for the Habs with Koivu and Tanguay. The line was agreat success, but Carbonneau must have deemed that Koivu and Tanguay were the main catalyst (they were) as Guilaume for his 7 points, only managed one goal again.
In all, he's played 76 games on one of the top two lines, and that's to say nothing of the times he's played on Robert Lang, Bryan Smolinski and Maxim Lapierre's line and received top ice time. To say Latendresse hasn't had a fair shake, therefore, is more than a bit disingenuous, and Gagnon must know it. He's had many, at least 4 or 5 very extended long looks and each time the coaches in charge have decided against granting him the permanent freedom of that designation.
Kostitsyn isn't really so different. He too has been given chances. The main difference being that in 2007-08 he made it count to the tune of 20 goals in his last 46 games.
But know this, as well. Andrei Kostitsyn got his chance after serving an apprenticeship in the AHL of almost 3 seasons. He played 180 games in all down in Hamilton where he scored 51 goals and 71 assists. His final season was 2006-07 where (with Guillaume 2 years his junior already in the NHL) he scored 20 goals and 32 assists in 50 contests.
When he came up to the NHL and finally earned a top line position around Game 63 of the 2006-07 season, he seized his opportunity by earning 11 points in those last 18 games. What's more, for his decent points total, his line was a constant threat and Plekanec was set alight with Andrei at the side.
Even then, nothing was earned for the young Belarussian. Leading the Hamilton Bulldogs in scoring, playing inspired hockey with the entrenched number 2 centre and already acknowledged for his talent was not enough to get a pass. Nor should it have been. As mentioned, once Grabovski sunk, it was Latendresse who auditioned for the wing to complement Pleks and Kovalev. Only after 8 games of Guillaume's tantalizing size, teamed with frustratingly few goals did Carbo shift Andrei in. Though Andrei did well, he like Gui didn't explode for points. But perhaps he was saved by the fact that Plekanec and Kovalev looked better with him at their side. Carbo's rare patience wasn't tested too much either, since Kostitsyn within a month of being given the opportunity was driving the line into December.
Stats play
One of the things that most frustrated me about Gagnon's thin excuse for journalism was this:
Kostitsyn qui a joué avec Plekanec et Alex Kostitsyn pendant une saison, qui est presque toujours au sein des deux premiers trios et qui profite d’une majorité d’attaques massives affiche 53 buts en 200 matchs dans la LNH.
Latendresse? Son but de samedi était son 48e en 223 parties.
Le Québécois n’a donc marqué que cinq buts de moins que son coéquipier en dépit d’une utilisation beaucoup plus timide.
It's a classic hatchet job on the stats. Opportunity to incorporate 34 games for Andrei where he largely did nothing during his adjustment (3 G in 34 games). Opportunity to ignore assists and what we can all see with our eyes altogether. Opportunity to put similar totals side by said and say they are the same.
It's a mess. Start with the goals. 53 in 200 is not 48 in 223. Andrei's scoring 0.265 goals a game, while Gui's clocking up 0.215. it may not seem like much, except over 82 games it's 4 goals – the difference between a proven 20 goalscorer for instance, and an aspiring one.
Next the assists. I think we know hockey is more than goals by individuals. Even with all the flaws of assists as a stat, I think we can appreciate that someone with an assist has contributed somewhat to a goal. I think we can appreciate how someone with 59 career assists has done a lot more than someone with 38. Pro-rate those and you get 0.295 vs. 0.156.
But let's all be sensible here. We have been watching as well. Until 2 years ago, Andrei Kostitsyn was a name to us, but not a player. In the two seasons since, he has actually been a 26 and a 23 goalscorer and had flashes of brilliance. Guillaume on the other hand has been about as good as the day of his promotion for the past 3 years. His rookie season he was a 16 goal man, the next season the same. Last season 14 goals. Seeing him as a one-day 20 goalscorer is debate enough, putting him the proven category is daydreaming.
Gagnon called out
The one thing I take heart from is the fact that Gagnon's blog generated a lot of commentary yesterday. And, while there were plenty of sycophants hoping for a pat on the back in return, a vast number (perhaps even the majority) of readers told him largely what I just told you.
Paul Bernier said this:
Quand on a plus rien à écrire, on parle de Latendresse.
Ceux qui connaissent un tant soit peu leur hockey voient indéniablement la différence de talent brut entre AK et Latendresse. AK est en court de changer sa façon de travailler, son implication au jeu. Quand ceci arrive, un joueur est déboussolé, déstabilisé, il perd ses repères.
Croyez-moi, son jeu se replacera très bientôt, et vous ne le reconnaitrez plus.
En ce qui concerne Latendresse, il ne peut donner plus que ce qu’il a présentement. Il se place encore à 10′ de la face du gardien malgré toutes les directives et se sort systématiquement du jeu à chaque mise en échec, comme un Peewee. Le talent ne s’apprend ou ne s’achète pas, malheureusement.
Jejol8 said this:
C’est très gentil pour Latendresse… mais Kostitsyn a beaucoup, mais là vraiment beaucoup plus de potentiel et c’est la raison pour laquelle on lui donne plus de chances.
“C’tivident” non??
Teamstef said this:
Lâchez-nous avec Guillaume! Non mais sérieusement, c’est fatiguant cette histoire qui revient toujours sur la table avec les médias franco. Guillaume la victime! SVP! Andrei a déjà montré qu’il pouvait dominer. Je n’ai pas encore vû ça de Guillaume.
De toute façon, quand on est rendu à dire que Guillaime Latendresse dervait être sur le deuxième trio d’une équipe de la LNH, c’est vraiment qu’on a pas de club!
It continues...
Francois Gagnon, in his unexplained character assassination attempt on the Kostitsyns is apparently only digging his own grave. I can only assume he's consumed with it and doesn't even realise. If I ever descend into this state, I implore you all – tell me.
The Habs top lines then
All this to say, it's all nonsense. If the Canadiens want to score more goals they must stop trying to choose between Kostitsyn and Latendresse and choose the two of them. Yes Kostitsyn is ultimately the more talented, but Guilaume has his merits and at his best offers the 6th best skill set on the team.
I suppose the day that Glen Metropolit and Travis Moen stop scoring from behind the goal line is the day the coach can put his best PP out and start forming lines that will last.
Sunday, November 01, 2009
Game #14
Montreal Gets Hallowe'en Scare Against League's Worst
Details
Date: 31/10/09
Opponent: Maple Leafs
Location: Montreal

Win: 5-4 (SO)
Habs Goalie: Halak (W)
Opposition Goalie: Toskala (L)
Habs goalscorers: Metropolit, Latendresse, Gill, Hamrlik, (Cammalleri, Gomez - SO)
Opposition goalscorers: Ponikarovsky (2), Stempniak, Kaberle
The play of the game comes in two installments tonight, but both were very similar. I am so pleased about these plays as it not only was a great demonstration of our skill, but was also an example of just how weak a team Toronto is and of how inadequate Toskala is - it was great! The plays that I am referring to are obviously the to shootout goals scored by Cammalleri and Gomez. Both players came in with speed, stickhandled just a bit and then put hard and accurate shots up and over Toskala's non-existent glove hand. It was comical to see how bad he was with his glove and great to see that we knew how to expose it.
Tomas Plekanec
I think that it is pretty safe to say that, once again, Pleks was probably one of our best forwards tonight if not the best. His assault on last year's assist total of 19 continues as he is now more than halfway there (10). His 2 points last night give him 13 in 14 games and he is actually playing better than his numbers would suggest as well. He was great against Toronto and seems so at ease in his role on the team this year.
Mike Cammalleri
It is hard to believe that Mike didn't pick up a point in this one because he was absolutely everywhere. He was instrumental in Ha Gill's goal, but thanks to the NHL's way of assigning points he didn't collect one. He also scored a great goal in the shootout, but again this isn't recognized by the league. What the league will record is the fact that he led the team in shots (6) (and, although not noted, he likely led in quality chances too), led the game in takeaways (3) and played for nearly 20 minutes.
Glen Metropolit
Glen's good play continued against Toronto and this time he was rewarded with a goal. Call it a gift from Toskala (it was horrible technique) or call it whatever you want, but a goal is a goal. The main thing is that he tried the shot from a horrible angle and, by knowing his opponent and his weaknesses, it turned out very well. As his solid play continues he'll likely continue to see increased PP time (3+ minutes - more than 10 times more than Kostitsyn), higher than average ice-time (17+ minutes) and, hopefully, he'll be valuable at face-offs (he was 71% in this game).
Defencemen
Roman Hamrlik - Game Puck
Roman is certainly getting the job done this year and, I think, that last night he was at his best. Just by looking at his numbers it will help to paint the picture. 1 Goal, 27+ minutes, 4 shots, 4 hits (team-high), 3 blocked-shots and a +1 rating. Martin is using him in all situations and actually used him more than any other player in this one. By playing nearly half of the game he gives the Habs a very good chance (during that half at least) of outplaying the opponents. Both defensively and offensively I am really liking what I am seeing.
Paul Mara
Paul was able to outplay Gorges and Spacek in this one (Gill and Bergeron are givens) as he really did a good job defensively. He was very strong in one-on-one situations and did well in his battles along the boards. I never saw a major mistake and liked how he never over-commited by taking himself out of position (Komisarek's presence makes you thankful when your own D-men don't stray too far from developing plays for stat purposes). He didn't get a point and wasn't on the ice for any of the 8 goals. That type of neutral hockey, however, is quite alright with me; especially when it lasts 20+ minutes.
Goaltender
Jaroslav Halak
Is Halak our starter now? Has he earned #1 status? I really think it is hard to say and I am pretty sure that Martin and Gainey couldn't answer that now, but, you know what? Who cares. The bottom line is that Jaro is finding ways to win games. Maybe his opponents haven't been the cream of the league, but he is making sure that, as a team, we are winning the games that we should be. To me that alone is enough justification for the increase in playing time. I wasn't too impressed with his play during the game(4 goals on 30 shots), but some were lucky on the Leafs front. His play, however, in the shootout was what impressed me. He made two big saves on the only two shots he faced and, thus, gave the Leafs no chance at all of winning this game.
Comments
So, all in all, it was the week that I expected; 4 points and no wins (or points) against the tougher competition of the week. I am pretty happy that we beat Toronto and I'm not even that worried that it happened in OT that I doubt 45 or 46 points on the year for the Leafs will matter to us much. Atlanta, Boston and Tampa Bay is the week that we have ahead of us and I think this is a good chance to get some extra points. I am going to set the expectations high at 4 points as I think it is time we get on a real roll here and about time that we get moving up these standings.
Labels:
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Friday, October 30, 2009
Martin Getting There
New Habs Lines Spread The Wealth
In his brief time here in Montreal, Jacques Martin has found our best line. On his ten question exam, that was the first problem, the giveaway warm up one.
And while it's a "well done" to Jacques for discovering that putting the 39 goalscorer with duo that combined for goals galore and Cups in the past, it wasn't exactly a headscratcher.
What was and remains a headscratcher was/is finding out how to get some offensive production from his lower lines, most specifically his wingers. The problem of making his team hard to defend against (something which they have proved they are not when facing the better teams in the league).
After 12 regular season games and 8 in the pre-season, Jacques should be starting to get a feel for some of his assets beyond the obvious big three. What he might have noticed by now is that Plekanec is a very good, if temperamental, player. He may have noticed that Andrei Kostitsyn is the only forward from the remaining group who can beat a player one on one and certainly the only one who can stare down a goalie who has set his feet for the save and score. He may have noticed that Latendresse has hands but needs a big brother to push him into the role he seems reluctant to take. And he may have noticed that the rest of the guys deserve credit for their effort, but aren't going to a big part of the solution to the scoring problem in the long-term.
Line changes
Today we have news that good old Jacques is shuffling the deck. And while the Francois Gagnon's of the world will be infuriated that Andrei Kostitsyn appears to be getting rewarded for his lack-lustre production. As always the one-eyed critics miss the point entirely.
This move isn't about rewarding Andrei Kostitsyn in the least. It isn't about the individual players at all. What it is about is the search for the chemical equation that will yield two good offensive lines from a list of 12 possible reagents.
I have to say I am in full agreement. i think the time for rewarding Travis Moen for working hard or rewarding Max Pacioretty for not being a sulky Belarussian has come and gone. Sooner or later, Jacques had to look beyond sending messages to a couple of players and begin sending the message to the league (and us fans) that the Canadiens will be a team to be reckoned with.
The more astute among you will have noticed that these changes actually happened between periods 2 and 3 of the last game when Martin swapped Cammalleri for Kostitsyn straight up. The most astute readers will remember that based on some reason and statistical precedent, this was the first line that we all thought should be trotted out as number 1 (or 2, if you consider centre 1 and winger 1 will now be united).
I'll just refresh the memory as to why we thought it might make sense in the first place:
1) Kostitsyn and Plekanec no longer work well together.
They didn't all last season, they haven't in the first spell this season. Don't ask me why, it's just so. Might as well work on another combo
2) Gomez and Gionta (the unbreakable duo for now) both shoot like crazy.
Their default setting is shoot, even Gomez's passes are often shots. It made less sense, to me anyway, to add another shooting machine to the line. After all, who would be the puck holder, who would challenge the goalie to think that a pass might come instead. Cammalleri was successful on the first line, but looking at his goals, a lot were self-made and many were quick shots that happened to come off. What we have seen against good teams is that they can allow the shots (knowing they'll come) and set their minds to cleaning up the rebounds.
3) Kostitsyn is in all likelihood the second best (if not the best) shooter on the team in terms of accuracy and quality of release.
At the end of the day, this will probably translate to more goals than 15 of the group of 18 forwards. In short, he's a top goal threat. So no matter what his attitude to mucking it up in the corners may be, it is in the interest of the coaches to potentiate this asset. Allowing him his first experimental run with Scott Gomez is a logical step in the experiment to get him firing again.
Almost there
If he's found the way to play Kostitsyn on a scoring line without Plekanec, Jacques still has to figure out which of the young French Canadian duo is the goalscorer.
PLaying Maxim Lapierre on line two is a nice plaudit for the young man, which he deserves after last season, but come April it would be surprising if his name were to be found above that of Guillaume Latendresse when you sort the stats for goals scored.
Max is a lot of things, plucky, committed, competitive, spiny, energetic; but he won't ever be mistaken for a goal-machine. That's not to say that Gui will ever be said machine. However, with Plekanec's smoothe passing and Cammalleri's machine-gunning pucks at the net, the quicker hands should win the day here.
If it's not to be Guillaume, Maxim is still the wrong choice in my books. The place beside the top scorers is more suited to wingers like Pacioretty and D'Agostini, so Lapierre can get back to doing what he actually does well.
And, not to nit pick, but this is only questions 2 and 3 on Martin's exam sheet. There's that whole defence to work out next. Maybe once he gets to it, he'll even realise that Hal Gill is not a defender for every type of opponent and that he should get hold of the ear of his GM to mention that spare money kicking around because he hasn't replaced Markov.
Patience. Again.
Although I'm fairly convinced that some of the reasons I put forward these lines in the first place were right, I would hesitate to say everything falls into place this evening against the Hawks.
Once again, a little bit of patience is required. Both Gomez and Gionta have been good, but will need time to acclimatise to having a puck-carrying and more discerning shooter at their sides. Ditto Plekanec, who will have to adjust a bit to the frantic pace of a Cammalleri shift.
I tell you what though, if this works, then teams like Pittsburgh will have to think twice about trotting out Martin Skoula to defend the line Kostitsyn's on.
And while it's a "well done" to Jacques for discovering that putting the 39 goalscorer with duo that combined for goals galore and Cups in the past, it wasn't exactly a headscratcher.
What was and remains a headscratcher was/is finding out how to get some offensive production from his lower lines, most specifically his wingers. The problem of making his team hard to defend against (something which they have proved they are not when facing the better teams in the league).
After 12 regular season games and 8 in the pre-season, Jacques should be starting to get a feel for some of his assets beyond the obvious big three. What he might have noticed by now is that Plekanec is a very good, if temperamental, player. He may have noticed that Andrei Kostitsyn is the only forward from the remaining group who can beat a player one on one and certainly the only one who can stare down a goalie who has set his feet for the save and score. He may have noticed that Latendresse has hands but needs a big brother to push him into the role he seems reluctant to take. And he may have noticed that the rest of the guys deserve credit for their effort, but aren't going to a big part of the solution to the scoring problem in the long-term.
Line changes
Today we have news that good old Jacques is shuffling the deck. And while the Francois Gagnon's of the world will be infuriated that Andrei Kostitsyn appears to be getting rewarded for his lack-lustre production. As always the one-eyed critics miss the point entirely.
This move isn't about rewarding Andrei Kostitsyn in the least. It isn't about the individual players at all. What it is about is the search for the chemical equation that will yield two good offensive lines from a list of 12 possible reagents.
I have to say I am in full agreement. i think the time for rewarding Travis Moen for working hard or rewarding Max Pacioretty for not being a sulky Belarussian has come and gone. Sooner or later, Jacques had to look beyond sending messages to a couple of players and begin sending the message to the league (and us fans) that the Canadiens will be a team to be reckoned with.
The more astute among you will have noticed that these changes actually happened between periods 2 and 3 of the last game when Martin swapped Cammalleri for Kostitsyn straight up. The most astute readers will remember that based on some reason and statistical precedent, this was the first line that we all thought should be trotted out as number 1 (or 2, if you consider centre 1 and winger 1 will now be united).
I'll just refresh the memory as to why we thought it might make sense in the first place:
1) Kostitsyn and Plekanec no longer work well together.
They didn't all last season, they haven't in the first spell this season. Don't ask me why, it's just so. Might as well work on another combo
2) Gomez and Gionta (the unbreakable duo for now) both shoot like crazy.
Their default setting is shoot, even Gomez's passes are often shots. It made less sense, to me anyway, to add another shooting machine to the line. After all, who would be the puck holder, who would challenge the goalie to think that a pass might come instead. Cammalleri was successful on the first line, but looking at his goals, a lot were self-made and many were quick shots that happened to come off. What we have seen against good teams is that they can allow the shots (knowing they'll come) and set their minds to cleaning up the rebounds.
3) Kostitsyn is in all likelihood the second best (if not the best) shooter on the team in terms of accuracy and quality of release.
At the end of the day, this will probably translate to more goals than 15 of the group of 18 forwards. In short, he's a top goal threat. So no matter what his attitude to mucking it up in the corners may be, it is in the interest of the coaches to potentiate this asset. Allowing him his first experimental run with Scott Gomez is a logical step in the experiment to get him firing again.
Almost there
If he's found the way to play Kostitsyn on a scoring line without Plekanec, Jacques still has to figure out which of the young French Canadian duo is the goalscorer.
PLaying Maxim Lapierre on line two is a nice plaudit for the young man, which he deserves after last season, but come April it would be surprising if his name were to be found above that of Guillaume Latendresse when you sort the stats for goals scored.
Max is a lot of things, plucky, committed, competitive, spiny, energetic; but he won't ever be mistaken for a goal-machine. That's not to say that Gui will ever be said machine. However, with Plekanec's smoothe passing and Cammalleri's machine-gunning pucks at the net, the quicker hands should win the day here.
If it's not to be Guillaume, Maxim is still the wrong choice in my books. The place beside the top scorers is more suited to wingers like Pacioretty and D'Agostini, so Lapierre can get back to doing what he actually does well.
And, not to nit pick, but this is only questions 2 and 3 on Martin's exam sheet. There's that whole defence to work out next. Maybe once he gets to it, he'll even realise that Hal Gill is not a defender for every type of opponent and that he should get hold of the ear of his GM to mention that spare money kicking around because he hasn't replaced Markov.
Patience. Again.
Although I'm fairly convinced that some of the reasons I put forward these lines in the first place were right, I would hesitate to say everything falls into place this evening against the Hawks.
Once again, a little bit of patience is required. Both Gomez and Gionta have been good, but will need time to acclimatise to having a puck-carrying and more discerning shooter at their sides. Ditto Plekanec, who will have to adjust a bit to the frantic pace of a Cammalleri shift.
I tell you what though, if this works, then teams like Pittsburgh will have to think twice about trotting out Martin Skoula to defend the line Kostitsyn's on.
Labels:
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Tuesday, October 27, 2009
Rethinking Andrei Kostitsyn
Having a good scan of the Habs universe yesterday brought me to this very salient piece on Francois Gagnon's favourite player, Andrei Kostitsyn.
Take it from me, it's nice as a blogger to find a piece you wanted to write yourself. It gives time back to watch more highlights and read more trade rumours.
Anyway, I thought the piece was very well stated, a good indictment of those who relentlessly malign the young Belarussian. The aim of its writing, would also be as my own:
I think this is fair enough, don't you?
I know that Andrei's had a sluggish start to the season relative to some others, but it hasn't been as abysmal as some commentators (Brunet, Gagnon) constantly suggest that it has been.
Gagnon, never missing an opportunity to continue the agenda he set off last spring, seemed to display real elation in his headline as wrote: "Kostitsyn demoted, finally". Brunet, as you know only takes breaks from boosting Guillaume Latendresse to sling insults at the Kostitsyn brothers.
Rather than ask those commentators to find nasty things to say about 1-goal men Latendresse and Pacioretty, I would simply prefer that they back off a little on Kostitsyn, as I think many do. After all, this season is 11 games long and our top remaining goalscorer from last year is only a three-point game away from springing back onto his usual pace.
Jacques Martin's move misread?
Though Gagnon leaped on the practice alignment for his agenda-fitting headline, I think it may just be possible that Jacques Martin's move was blown out of proportion. For one thing, the "demotion" from Plekanec's line where he wasn't clicking anyway only lasted 30 minutes. In the end, Andrei played only a shade less than Latendresse at even strength, and saw a lot more ice than new golden stick Glen Metropolit, which doesn't exactly scream doghouse.
Secondly, Chipchura had been a warrior the game before, a possession centre without a finisher – the demotion for Andrei was also a nice attempt to see if Chips could benefit from some extra talent around.
Patience
As a frequent winner of my hockey pool's October standings, and a very infrequent winner of the April edition, I've learned a lot about patience. The players we rave about today will not be the same group we rave about on the eve of the important games. Nor will the players who are dogging it in our minds now there interminably.
Some patience needs to be exercised in watching and evaluating young Andrei Kostitsyn, before we boo him off the team in a trade we may regret because:
Apology
Just as a note on something else that the AllHabs article brought up for me. I hadn't really thought about it before, but Rocket at AllHabs puts it very well when he asks just why there hasn't been any sign of apology from the reporters who slandered (and continue to slander) the Kostitsyns as criminals:
And to requote myself:
Come to think of it, I do think an apology is due. And though I never expect one, perhaps in lieu of one, Gagnon and Brunet in particular could offer some peace for the winger trying to crack a 5.3 shooting percentage slump.
Take it from me, it's nice as a blogger to find a piece you wanted to write yourself. It gives time back to watch more highlights and read more trade rumours.
Anyway, I thought the piece was very well stated, a good indictment of those who relentlessly malign the young Belarussian. The aim of its writing, would also be as my own:
"The intention of this article is not to absolve Kostitsyn. He is responsible for his play, his attitude and his work ethic. It's simply to encourage a more balanced assessment of all players regardless of their birthplace."
I think this is fair enough, don't you?
I know that Andrei's had a sluggish start to the season relative to some others, but it hasn't been as abysmal as some commentators (Brunet, Gagnon) constantly suggest that it has been.
Gagnon, never missing an opportunity to continue the agenda he set off last spring, seemed to display real elation in his headline as wrote: "Kostitsyn demoted, finally". Brunet, as you know only takes breaks from boosting Guillaume Latendresse to sling insults at the Kostitsyn brothers.
Rather than ask those commentators to find nasty things to say about 1-goal men Latendresse and Pacioretty, I would simply prefer that they back off a little on Kostitsyn, as I think many do. After all, this season is 11 games long and our top remaining goalscorer from last year is only a three-point game away from springing back onto his usual pace.
Jacques Martin's move misread?
Though Gagnon leaped on the practice alignment for his agenda-fitting headline, I think it may just be possible that Jacques Martin's move was blown out of proportion. For one thing, the "demotion" from Plekanec's line where he wasn't clicking anyway only lasted 30 minutes. In the end, Andrei played only a shade less than Latendresse at even strength, and saw a lot more ice than new golden stick Glen Metropolit, which doesn't exactly scream doghouse.
Secondly, Chipchura had been a warrior the game before, a possession centre without a finisher – the demotion for Andrei was also a nice attempt to see if Chips could benefit from some extra talent around.
Patience
As a frequent winner of my hockey pool's October standings, and a very infrequent winner of the April edition, I've learned a lot about patience. The players we rave about today will not be the same group we rave about on the eve of the important games. Nor will the players who are dogging it in our minds now there interminably.
Some patience needs to be exercised in watching and evaluating young Andrei Kostitsyn, before we boo him off the team in a trade we may regret because:
"By all accounts, the Canadiens are short a top six forward. It would be a shame to lose another one."
Apology
Just as a note on something else that the AllHabs article brought up for me. I hadn't really thought about it before, but Rocket at AllHabs puts it very well when he asks just why there hasn't been any sign of apology from the reporters who slandered (and continue to slander) the Kostitsyns as criminals:
"Both Kostitsyn brothers and Roman Hamrlik were the victims of rumours, embellished associations, and shoddy journalism by the Montreal media last season. To date, there has been no public apology for the outrageous accusations made by certain journalists and commentators. Some even continue to defame the three by referencing the false stories."
And to requote myself:
"No one really cared whether they were criminal or not, what will be remembered is that game with frenzied hacks claiming the scoop of the century – and that said scoop implicated the Belarussians. It's propaganda 101, people don't care too much about the facts. Give them a "juicy" (to borrow a term from the man himself) headline and they'll remember that."
Come to think of it, I do think an apology is due. And though I never expect one, perhaps in lieu of one, Gagnon and Brunet in particular could offer some peace for the winger trying to crack a 5.3 shooting percentage slump.
Thursday, October 22, 2009
Kostitsyn vs. Gainey
Habs Won't Win The Way They've Been Going
Just a day or two ago, wasn't it, that we were full of Sergei's obvious change in attitude as he scored a couple of goals and made AHL defenders look like, well, AHL defenders.
It seems that Sergei was also full of the same bravado that day as (after reading our praise, probably) he took off to whereabouts unknown. The assumption from the Habs and agent was Russia, the reality is that they probably didn't look very hard. So from suspended to reformed hero to suspended to AHL commuter again – quite a drama down on the farm.
As the facts emerge, we may get to know more on the specifics, but know this – this is a standoff between Gainey and Sergei Kostitsyn. It is a wrangle over talent assessment, fairness, expectation, discipline and who's in charge. It didn't begin yesterday, it began a long time ago.

It goes back to 4th line duty, full-period benchings and of course that scandal and demotion that last saw Sergei in the AHL last February.
Sergei's beef, which several people (surprisingly Michel Bergeron among them) see eye to eye with is that the player has been wrongly overlooked. Anyone with a modicum of hockey watching experience can see he brings much more to the table than Greg Stewart, Matt D'Agostini, Kyle Chipchura or Georges Laraque, and probably more than Pacioretty, Latendresse and Maxim Lapierre. To put it succinctly, Sergei believes as do some others that he is the 6th most talented forward in the whole organization. he believes Gainey is cutting off his nose to spite his face.
On the other side, Gainey has a point. Sergei could be more mature, he could be more concentrated and more prompt. In Gainey's version, he must not only be setting an example to others with demands, but also thinking that Sergei could learn something from dominating the lower league and riding some buses again. He must think that this injection of fury could turn to desire and ultimately performance.
But really, setting an example? Who for?
If we read it as a lesson to other players, it's clear enough: Work hard, do what we ask of you and you will play and play well. It's a nice message. Now, I'm all for setting examples of people. but there comes a certain point when you have to ask, just who is Gainey trying to set an example for with Sergei Kostitsyn?
The next players in the depth chart talent-wise aren't learning anything, because they're all on the Habs despite their poor play and poor attention to detail in their work. While the players after Sergei in Hamilton are Ben Maxwell, Ryan White and Brock Trotter. If any one of them sees the NHL light of day in the next 5 years for any reason other than injuries, it would be a surprise.
My take here is that sometimes, at risk of upsetting the lesser lights, sometimes a GM just has to provide a little more care, a little more attention to the talent that matters. Since finding another 131-point OHLer in the 7th round will be hard and teaching those skills to the schleps that are on the farm already is a pipe dream, Gainey's imperative with Sergei needs to be to hold on to what he has, at least he can return his value in a trade.
I tend to agree with Michel Bergeron (twice in a day, I need a long bath...) who says:
He's right you know. Imagine, Chelios had been fined instead of traded. Ditto Corson first time around. If Patrick Kane were a Hab, he'd have been traded by now for fear of tarnishing the tradition of the past – a tradition so sacred that it may take 100 years of losing (seemingly) and a new tradition of total mediocrity to overturn.
If anything is clear from this debacle it is that Sergei is not responding to tough love – at least not without tender explanation on the side. He's a prima donna with some primo talents. If Gainey and co. continue to hard ball him, it appears that everyone will lose, most importantly the Habs.
I think it's high time they take stock of this situation and begin to channel a lot more effort into keeping their most talented prospects happy and wanted. If not, well mediocrity for years.
"We should stop drafting Russians..."
Of course, this whole series of events gives wonderful fodder to those who camped themselves under the anti-Kostitsyn flag. It's a popular place to be these days, and it will be interesting to see whether those there now will pretend this never happened just like when they kissed Kovalev's feet in 2007-08. Anyway, arguments on trading them, whether they should play and where are all bordering on fair. But I've seen quite a few nonsensical bits around starting to pop up about how the Habs are wasting their picks when they choose Russians (or former Soviet citizens at least).
I have to be frank, anyone who says we wasted a pick on Sergei Kostitsyn is more than mildly delusional. Sergei was picked 200th overall in the 7th round of the 2005 draft. Usually, one would be lucky to remember the name of a player like that. To have mined 108 NHL games out of that player in 4 seasons since the draft is remarkable.
Not only does this show me that the picks have not been wasted, it shows me that we need to keep drafting Russians (and Belarussians, Ukrainians, Kazakhs, Latvians, etc.). They simply offer more value for the pick.
People often wonder aloud how Detroit has managed to maintain their excellence over the past decade and they need not look any further than this same mentality they take into the draft. Whereas the Wings have been as dismal as the worst NHL clubs in picking up North American talent from well-scouted leagues, they have made a living out of taking chances where they know their chances will pay off. Fedorov, Konstantinov and Lidstrom made the first wave of the Wings dynasty tick. All looked like high risk picks to those that have neither the patience nor the whereabouts to develop a European talent into an NHL star. The fact that they have repeated the trick with Zetterberg, Franzen and Datsyuk only further proves the point.
Now that the Swedish scouting game has been blown wide open (see draft, 2009), Russia really represents the richest vein of talent at its most untapped. What's more, as more and more teams shy away from the hassle that a few long distance phone calls and maybe some disappointments after a long tease (instead of a retirement straight out of high school) good Russian talent is slipping further down the rounds. Witness the Canadiens taking the third Russian player in the draft this season at 109th overall. Now, even if he doesn't actually turn out to be the next Ovechkin, you could never convince me he won't be better than Nick Oliver taken 110th overall.
Best case scenarios
For the Habs there really are only two scenarios that work from here on with Sergei:
1) Gainey gets him to calm down long enough (months) to start excelling in the AHL, calls him up and then trades him for similar value
2) Gainey gets him to calm down long enough (days/weeks) to start playing in the AHL so the GM can save face, calls him up and he replaces the blank-firing youngsters we currently carry night-in, night-out on the roster with panache and attitude of his best vintage
I thoroughly hope that it ends up being one of these. As I indicate, both routes require a bit of work for Gainey, which we know is asking a lot in his holiday months of August to June...
It seems that Sergei was also full of the same bravado that day as (after reading our praise, probably) he took off to whereabouts unknown. The assumption from the Habs and agent was Russia, the reality is that they probably didn't look very hard. So from suspended to reformed hero to suspended to AHL commuter again – quite a drama down on the farm.
As the facts emerge, we may get to know more on the specifics, but know this – this is a standoff between Gainey and Sergei Kostitsyn. It is a wrangle over talent assessment, fairness, expectation, discipline and who's in charge. It didn't begin yesterday, it began a long time ago.

It goes back to 4th line duty, full-period benchings and of course that scandal and demotion that last saw Sergei in the AHL last February.
Sergei's beef, which several people (surprisingly Michel Bergeron among them) see eye to eye with is that the player has been wrongly overlooked. Anyone with a modicum of hockey watching experience can see he brings much more to the table than Greg Stewart, Matt D'Agostini, Kyle Chipchura or Georges Laraque, and probably more than Pacioretty, Latendresse and Maxim Lapierre. To put it succinctly, Sergei believes as do some others that he is the 6th most talented forward in the whole organization. he believes Gainey is cutting off his nose to spite his face.
On the other side, Gainey has a point. Sergei could be more mature, he could be more concentrated and more prompt. In Gainey's version, he must not only be setting an example to others with demands, but also thinking that Sergei could learn something from dominating the lower league and riding some buses again. He must think that this injection of fury could turn to desire and ultimately performance.
But really, setting an example? Who for?
If we read it as a lesson to other players, it's clear enough: Work hard, do what we ask of you and you will play and play well. It's a nice message. Now, I'm all for setting examples of people. but there comes a certain point when you have to ask, just who is Gainey trying to set an example for with Sergei Kostitsyn?
The next players in the depth chart talent-wise aren't learning anything, because they're all on the Habs despite their poor play and poor attention to detail in their work. While the players after Sergei in Hamilton are Ben Maxwell, Ryan White and Brock Trotter. If any one of them sees the NHL light of day in the next 5 years for any reason other than injuries, it would be a surprise.
My take here is that sometimes, at risk of upsetting the lesser lights, sometimes a GM just has to provide a little more care, a little more attention to the talent that matters. Since finding another 131-point OHLer in the 7th round will be hard and teaching those skills to the schleps that are on the farm already is a pipe dream, Gainey's imperative with Sergei needs to be to hold on to what he has, at least he can return his value in a trade.
I tend to agree with Michel Bergeron (twice in a day, I need a long bath...) who says:
Je crois qu’on est un peu trop puritains à Montréal. Les bons petits gars qui restent assis à manger des biscuits secs et à boire leur verre de lait, ce n’est pas toujours ceux qui te font gagner!
I think they're a bit too puritanical in Montreal. Good little boys who go to bed with milk and cookies – it's not always the best way to build a winner.
He's right you know. Imagine, Chelios had been fined instead of traded. Ditto Corson first time around. If Patrick Kane were a Hab, he'd have been traded by now for fear of tarnishing the tradition of the past – a tradition so sacred that it may take 100 years of losing (seemingly) and a new tradition of total mediocrity to overturn.
If anything is clear from this debacle it is that Sergei is not responding to tough love – at least not without tender explanation on the side. He's a prima donna with some primo talents. If Gainey and co. continue to hard ball him, it appears that everyone will lose, most importantly the Habs.
I think it's high time they take stock of this situation and begin to channel a lot more effort into keeping their most talented prospects happy and wanted. If not, well mediocrity for years.
"We should stop drafting Russians..."
Of course, this whole series of events gives wonderful fodder to those who camped themselves under the anti-Kostitsyn flag. It's a popular place to be these days, and it will be interesting to see whether those there now will pretend this never happened just like when they kissed Kovalev's feet in 2007-08. Anyway, arguments on trading them, whether they should play and where are all bordering on fair. But I've seen quite a few nonsensical bits around starting to pop up about how the Habs are wasting their picks when they choose Russians (or former Soviet citizens at least).
I have to be frank, anyone who says we wasted a pick on Sergei Kostitsyn is more than mildly delusional. Sergei was picked 200th overall in the 7th round of the 2005 draft. Usually, one would be lucky to remember the name of a player like that. To have mined 108 NHL games out of that player in 4 seasons since the draft is remarkable.
Not only does this show me that the picks have not been wasted, it shows me that we need to keep drafting Russians (and Belarussians, Ukrainians, Kazakhs, Latvians, etc.). They simply offer more value for the pick.
People often wonder aloud how Detroit has managed to maintain their excellence over the past decade and they need not look any further than this same mentality they take into the draft. Whereas the Wings have been as dismal as the worst NHL clubs in picking up North American talent from well-scouted leagues, they have made a living out of taking chances where they know their chances will pay off. Fedorov, Konstantinov and Lidstrom made the first wave of the Wings dynasty tick. All looked like high risk picks to those that have neither the patience nor the whereabouts to develop a European talent into an NHL star. The fact that they have repeated the trick with Zetterberg, Franzen and Datsyuk only further proves the point.
Now that the Swedish scouting game has been blown wide open (see draft, 2009), Russia really represents the richest vein of talent at its most untapped. What's more, as more and more teams shy away from the hassle that a few long distance phone calls and maybe some disappointments after a long tease (instead of a retirement straight out of high school) good Russian talent is slipping further down the rounds. Witness the Canadiens taking the third Russian player in the draft this season at 109th overall. Now, even if he doesn't actually turn out to be the next Ovechkin, you could never convince me he won't be better than Nick Oliver taken 110th overall.
Best case scenarios
For the Habs there really are only two scenarios that work from here on with Sergei:
1) Gainey gets him to calm down long enough (months) to start excelling in the AHL, calls him up and then trades him for similar value
2) Gainey gets him to calm down long enough (days/weeks) to start playing in the AHL so the GM can save face, calls him up and he replaces the blank-firing youngsters we currently carry night-in, night-out on the roster with panache and attitude of his best vintage
I thoroughly hope that it ends up being one of these. As I indicate, both routes require a bit of work for Gainey, which we know is asking a lot in his holiday months of August to June...
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